Ford Focus ST Forum banner
1 - 20 of 41 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
of course it's worth it if you have been caught but does it actually slow you down?

i think it just makes you more aware of where the cameras actually are. i think most roads have daft speed limits anyway, i wish there is more money spent on training or police patrols on things that actually causes accidents.

it's so frustrating when they are obviously there to make money especially when they always put a trap at the bottom of a hill but never on top of a hill when it's quite possible to break the speed limit but it's just less likely.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
Well once upon a time I thought they were but let's look at it this way I believe it cost around £85 to do it or a £60 fine and three points but on my last renewal I was told that insurance companies will start taking into consideration sac's in the same light as 3 points and will increase premiums accordingly well if this is true then you are going to pay £25 more to sit in a room for 4hrs watch a few videos and still get an increased premium then I won't do another that's for sure.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,607 Posts
I attended a drivers improvement course after a crash resulted in a potential conviction for careless driving. I went in expecting it to be a waste of time but I did take a few things from it, mainly following distances.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
to be frank, it will tell you that speed kills and that you shouldn't follow closely but how is it that it takes a video to tell people that? surely everyone knows that anyway.

i honestly think they are a waste of time and it's another way to build the bank balance for the council. i wish i can come into power and just make a retest compulsory every 5 years roughly.

people will say that they need to drive because it's their livelihood but if you're not safe then you might end up killing someone and wrecking much more livelihoods. i always slow down in built up areas and be ready to stop, it really shouldn't need a "course" to show that to someone.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
58 Posts
to be frank, it will tell you that speed kills and that you shouldn't follow closely but how is it that it takes a video to tell people that? surely everyone knows that anyway.

i honestly think they are a waste of time and it's another way to build the bank balance for the council. i wish i can come into power and just make a retest compulsory every 5 years roughly.

people will say that they need to drive because it's their livelihood but if you're not safe then you might end up killing someone and wrecking much more livelihoods. i always slow down in built up areas and be ready to stop, it really shouldn't need a "course" to show that to someone.
The driving laws in this country are really crazy take drink drivers for instance and especially repeat offenders are these the type of people we want on our roads the type who are prepared to risk life and limb and mine and your lives NO, then why give them there license back, and if there a good boy and do a drink drive rehabilitation course get months and months knocked off there ban, there license is obviously not that important to them if not they would not have drank and drove in the first place would they so a ban for life it is then I say.....
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,177 Posts
to be frank, it will tell you that speed kills and that you shouldn't follow closely but how is it that it takes a video to tell people that? surely everyone knows that anyway.

i honestly think they are a waste of time and it's another way to build the bank balance for the council. i wish i can come into power and just make a retest compulsory every 5 years roughly.

people will say that they need to drive because it's their livelihood but if you're not safe then you might end up killing someone and wrecking much more livelihoods. i always slow down in built up areas and be ready to stop, it really shouldn't need a "course" to show that to someone.
The one i went on didnt really go on about speeding at all! It focused mainly on reading road conditions and assessing how fast you should be going! As i said i found it quite interesting and not a waste of time like i thought it would be!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
264 Posts
Lets face it in an 'ideal' world we wouldn't need speed limits. Everyone would know when you need to bring the speed down and when its time to have a bit of 'fun', but it's never going to happen, so instead we have to abide by the lowest common denominator and go by the numbers on a stick.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
264 Posts
i did one a few months back,makes you a bit more aware for a few days then its back to normal lol
Thats the impression I got. I've sat in on a couple of these courses a few years ago. Before the course you get a letter outlining the content and warning that any dissent and you will be removed and get the alternative points and a fine. So everyone sits there 'oohing' and 'aaghing' and nodding appreciatively at the right moments and then go on their way.
I daresay the message hits home for a few weeks and is then forgotten.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
253 Posts
I done one couple of years ago dare I say it the room was full of OLD people that had there licence ALOT longer than me and i was the youngest lol was intresting il admit but made me more aware what to look out for I always slow down going down hill now lol did enjoy the free cake and coffee though haha
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
10,661 Posts
Thats the impression I got. I've sat in on a couple of these courses a few years ago. Before the course you get a letter outlining the content and warning that any dissent and you will be removed and get the alternative points and a fine. So everyone sits there 'oohing' and 'aaghing' and nodding appreciatively at the right moments and then go on their way.
I daresay the message hits home for a few weeks and is then forgotten.
Yes I agree Mike that is the impression I hot from from my partner. She came home full of the impact from what she had seen and heard. Her fault lies in driving just above the speed limit at times in 30 area's. Ive tried to tell her many times they are the locations the camera vans are most active. She has soon reverted back to her old ways. Only a couple of weeks ago she thought she had been caught again. Fortunately she had not.
 

·
Formerly Azionamento
Joined
·
2,760 Posts
pilotho said:
to be frank, it will tell you that speed kills and that you shouldn't follow closely but how is it that it takes a video to tell people that? surely everyone knows that anyway.
Really? So why do soooo many drivers do it?

I think it's fair to say different people react in different ways. The feedback is normally very positive however - the best presenters don't 'nag' but offer to share some info that might keep you're licence clean and help keep you safe. I am an instructor on the next course up from 'Speed Awareness' called 'Driver Alertness' - offered to those that would have been prosecuted for driving without due care. The morning is theory and the afternoon is out driving with me alongside coaching how to be better.

All drivers can be better (including me).

To 'Pilotho' - with all your professional training in your job, why are you very dismissive of driver training?

pilotho said:
i honestly think they are a waste of time and it's another way to build the bank balance for the council.
Oh come on - that's a very old myth and just doesn't stack up. In most areas 'Speed Awareness' and 'Driver Alertness' courses are sub-contracted to commercial training companies - the 'council' or police don't make any money what so ever from these so called 'diversionery' courses.

pilotho said:
I wish i can come into power and just make a retest compulsory every 5 years roughly.
Nice idea but it's not exactly a vote winner and it also means doing some 6 million test per year - a logistical nightmare.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
301 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
To 'Pilotho' - with all your professional training in your job, why are you very dismissive of driver training?
I am all for training and at this moment in time, I think driver training is definitely below par at the moment. I just think the courses at the moment are making people do it because they have been caught. If they are compulsory training then it would mean that everyone would have to do it rather just for the people that have been caught.

My point of the argument is that the cameras are always placed on the side where people are most likely to be caught, i.e. on the downhill section of the road rather than the uphill section. This tactic simply catches people who let the speed stray by about 5mph because the car was going down hill, hardly a menace on the road I would say. The frequent offenders for speed would know or have seen the camera because they are used to being on the road and therefore would not "benefit" from the speed awareness course. I feel at the end of the day, any speed can kill so rather then just making people straying over by a few mph, it should be made compulsory training.

If it is like you say, the driver gets some training from an instructor then I'm all for it but if they just turn up and watch a few videos then that's a waste of time.

What about the guys who are say 20 mph over the limit? They get banned and fined but do they get retraining as well? OK, they have to do another extended test but does it actually change their behaviour?

You said the retest would be a logistical nightmare but what about making retraining compulsory every 5 years? You could train any driving instructor to offer that.

My ultimate point is, there's a massive thing about speed kills but it's drivers skill level that kills because you could be doing 45 but if you have a head on then it's a total momentum of 90. It goes back to why I started this thread, driver speed awareness courses are just there for people that have been caught.
 

·
Formerly Azionamento
Joined
·
2,760 Posts
OK - I agree with some of what you say. I reiterate the feedback from the courses is overwhelmingly positive. I think there are 2 type of attendees on speed awareness courses...those that simply drift over the speed limit due to inattention or ignorance and those that knowingly drive over the speed limit because they think the rules don't apply to them.

A big part of the speed awareness courses are explaining the difference a small increas in speed does to the time you have and consequences of a resulting accident. Many people think that doing 'only 35' in a 30 doesn't really make much difference...it means that you would hit an object at 18mph where you would have stopped by doing 30...it's physics and doesn't matter what car you drive but it's counter-intuitive to most people's thinking.

Speed cameras are placed where there is a known history of accidents - downhill - yes it's easy to let the speed drift up towards 40 because many people drive in 4th or 5th gear but it still means they are more likely to contribute to the accident stats.

I should say I am not a fan of the 'speed kills' focus of road safety...much more should be made of driver education and driving at an appropriate speed for the conditions - that's what I coach when I'm with a driver.

So, pilotho, have you taken any driver training since you passed your L-test and if not, why not?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
241 Posts
I am all for training and at this moment in time, I think driver training is definitely below par at the moment. I just think the courses at the moment are making people do it because they have been caught. If they are compulsory training then it would mean that everyone would have to do it rather just for the people that have been caught.

My point of the argument is that the cameras are always placed on the side where people are most likely to be caught, i.e. on the downhill section of the road rather than the uphill section. This tactic simply catches people who let the speed stray by about 5mph because the car was going down hill, hardly a menace on the road I would say. The frequent offenders for speed would know or have seen the camera because they are used to being on the road and therefore would not "benefit" from the speed awareness course. I feel at the end of the day, any speed can kill so rather then just making people straying over by a few mph, it should be made compulsory training.

If it is like you say, the driver gets some training from an instructor then I'm all for it but if they just turn up and watch a few videos then that's a waste of time.

What about the guys who are say 20 mph over the limit? They get banned and fined but do they get retraining as well? OK, they have to do another extended test but does it actually change their behaviour?

You said the retest would be a logistical nightmare but what about making retraining compulsory every 5 years? You could train any driving instructor to offer that.

My ultimate point is, there's a massive thing about speed kills but it's drivers skill level that kills because you could be doing 45 but if you have a head on then it's a total momentum of 90. It goes back to why I started this thread, driver speed awareness courses are just there for people that have been caught.
I agree with 99% of what you have said. However you could argue that whilst those that let their speed 'stray' at times, eg when going downhill are not the most dangerous examples of bad driving, they are however not paying attention to what they are doing, are in the wrong gear for the section of road they are on and could therefore be at greater risk of an accident because they are not paying attention? The number of times we have all seen programmes on tv where the boys in blue have pulled a motorist over, asked the 'how fast were you going' question, only to be told 'errr, i don't know' or some other equally vague answer; how can someone NOT KNOW how fast they were going? The most likely answer is probably becuase they weren't paying attention; pretty ridiculous if you ask me.

Don't get me wrong, no-one is perfect and we all have slip ups, including me. However people who do it routinely and are generally 'on another planet' when they drive are one of the main groups who need targeting; how to get the message across, i have no idea!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,607 Posts
The number of times we have all seen programmes on tv where the boys in blue have pulled a motorist over, asked the 'how fast were you going' question, only to be told 'errr, i don't know' or some other equally vague answer; how can someone NOT KNOW how fast they were going? The most likely answer is probably becuase they weren't paying attention; pretty ridiculous if you ask me.
It's more likely because they know they were doing over the limit but play dumb
 
1 - 20 of 41 Posts
Top