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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi guys

As a new member I was wondering if there's a thread listing all spec and style changes from first production to date?.. I've read somewhere that from 07 the intercooler was uprated? is this so?, as a new owner it would be interesting reading, any further information on this great car.

Nige
 

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yep intercooler was changed 28-04-06, then again 12-01-2008

they also changed the chassis on 12-01-2009 and made it the same chassis as the RS version.. just with different body panels.

Block, and cylinder head was also changed to the same one used on the RS because presumebly they made some improvements to make it all stronger.

Rear disks are also the same as a standard focus, as well as front hubs, although the disks are larger on the front.
 

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QUOTE(RB2004 @ 9 Jan 2010, 05:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>they also changed the chassis on 12-01-2009 and made it the same chassis as the RS version.. just with different body panels.
What do you mean by the chassis? - I can understand they'll have modified some ST chassis parts so they'd commonise with the RS too but this would be along the lines of extra location holes, mounting points and so on. The chassis bits which make the RS different are the ones that are unique to the RS - front & rear suspension, steering system, brakes, lower subframe and the like. None of these changes will have affected the overall geometry or chassis performance of the ST.

QUOTE(RB2004 @ 9 Jan 2010, 05:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Block, and cylinder head was also changed to the same one used on the RS because presumebly they made some improvements to make it all stronger.
Nope. There have been no part number changes to the ST engine to indicate any significant design changes such as new head or block. The RS head is unique because it is ported differently than the ST.

Changes the ST has had over it's life are things like the intercooler, interior radio and lighting changed around 2007 from square green lit head unit to oval, red-lit style which then carried over to the facelift. Facelift ST lots of exerior changes, carbon-effect dash and centre console, keyless start options and so on.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Hi

I've heard the lighting changed on the 07 plate, what was the change?...we got our 07 plate st2 on Monday, and thought the headlights didn't change until the facelift 2008 plate. Please excuse any ignorance on my part

Nige
 

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QUOTE(troy45 @ 9 Jan 2010, 06:59 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>What do you mean by the chassis? - I can understand they'll have modified some ST chassis parts so they'd commonise with the RS too but this would be along the lines of extra location holes, mounting points and so on. The chassis bits which make the RS different are the ones that are unique to the RS - front & rear suspension, steering system, brakes, lower subframe and the like. None of these changes will have affected the overall geometry or chassis performance of the ST.

Nope. There have been no part number changes to the ST engine to indicate any significant design changes such as new head or block. The RS head is unique because it is ported differently than the ST.

Changes the ST has had over it's life are things like the intercooler, interior radio and lighting changed around 2007 from square green lit head unit to oval, red-lit style which then carried over to the facelift. Facelift ST lots of exerior changes, carbon-effect dash and centre console, keyless start options and so on.

in regards to chassis in referring to the bodyshell, excluding subframes, which suspension and steering components would be mounted onto, I know that because ive checked the individual part no.s for the components that make up the RS bodyshell, and ST bodyshell and they are both the same after 12-01-2009, excluding body panels.

The geometry of the ST wouldnt of changed but the chassis is probably slightly stiffer because ford modified some of the chassis structure, eg crossmembers etc to make the chassis stiffer so it handled better in corners.

So when they carried over the basic chassis/bodyshell excluding panels it would of improved the ST slightly as well.
Im not including anything that bolts onto the bodyshell though because those are separate components again such as the subframes, suspension, brakes, steering as those will be completely differeny.. most notibly because the RS has a wider track and uses the Revo knuckle on the front.

ST and RS cylinder heads have the same part number now.
FINIS: 1529284 6M5G-6C032-ABFrom: 03-12-2007 2.5L Duratec-ST (220/225PS) - VI5 1
FINIS: 1529284 6M5G-6C032-ABFrom: 12-01-2009 2.5L Duratec-RS (305PS) - VI5 1

So if the RS one was ported differently Ford also carried accross the same head to the ST.

only differences would probably be the cams.

If you do not believe me, check in your local ford dealer for the part numbers, of a plain cylinder head with nothing attached to it.

Here is a basic list of the similarities and differences, between the RS and ST engine,

Same cylinder Head & valve's
Same exhaust Camshaft
Same inlet manifold
Same Crankshaft
Same Oil Pump
Same Water Pump
Same ECU

Different Inlet Camshaft
Different con-rods and pistons
Different Main and big end bearings
Different head gasket
Different injectors
Different Turbo
Different Inter-cooler
Different exhaust system
Different fuel pump
Different radiator

again a check on part numbers in your local dealer should confirm that.
There is no block listed as a separate part from ford, but ford uprated the liners in the block for the RS, then carried that block accross to the ST, as it was a more reliable and stronger block... also saved them making 2 variants.

its just the components bolted to it and running inside like pistons that are different.
 

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I'll take a look in my crystal ball with those cylinder head part numbers on Monday, would have expected a significant change with the cyliner head driving a full engine part number change but they're still at AG level if I can remember the suffix off the top of my head. Without an engine part number change there's no tracability later on with which engines are which spec when you reference the part number.

Looking now at the lengthy Ford press release for the RS they don't actually mention head porting changes which is surprising cos I'd have expected that to complement the changes with the cams and being able to flow the extra air from the bigger turbo. So I've obviously got that bit wrong.

With the chassis parts they will have maximised commonisation and share parts but you're more looking at part numbers for the ST having been taken up a level due to common RS features being built in, and that part carrying over to the RS. The clue is with unique RS parts having a part number starting 9***. From a cost point of view there's little point carrying over more expensive RS parts to the ST cos that just adds a ton of oncost to the ST for no gain. So we're lucky if any improvements to the ST have resulted from parts being used as the basis for the RS - in reality it's the RS which is comprised mainly of ST parts.

ps did you add some more info to your post while I was taking ages typing this? finding all my spelling mistakes takes ages lol
 

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the full engine part number is different because there are differences on the full engine, such as the inlet camshaft, pistons, conrods, bearing shells, head gasket,etc lol, full engine for the RS is alot more expensive, so they arent 100% identical, but id say at least 60% identical... so if anybody wanted and had the money, they could turn an ST engine into an RS engine with new pistons, head gasket, conrods and bearing shells on the bottom end, and a new inlet camshaft, turbo etc.

but the block and head with nothing attached are basically the same.

Block, no part number is listed for that, but people on here and other places have had reliability issues with the ST block, so when ford did the RS they did something with the liners apparently to uprate them, then carried that accross to the ST.

Agreed about ford carrying accross more expensive RS components to the ST, they wouldnt of done that, just seem to of brought the basic chassis with nothing attached to it in line with 1 another.. but thats a manufacturing thing probably because its cheaper to produce 1 chassis, than 2 different 1s.. so all they do is shove different body panels on it.

Even the ST shares many components with a standard focus, like the rear disks are supposed to be the same, and the front hubs, its only the disks on the front that are different, and I know the ABS module is the same as a standard focus, suspension setup though is obviously different.
 

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QUOTE(RB2004 @ 9 Jan 2010, 05:02 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>yep intercooler was changed 28-04-06, then again 12-01-2008

they also changed the chassis on 12-01-2009 and made it the same chassis as the RS version.. just with different body panels.

Block, and cylinder head was also changed to the same one used on the RS because presumebly they made some improvements to make it all stronger.

Rear disks are also the same as a standard focus, as well as front hubs, although the disks are larger on the front.

i remember then changing the intercooler from 7 to 11 rows i think,so what did they do on the 12-01-2008?
 

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its probably listed to 12-01-2008, because that was when the facelift came out.

then when you look under facelift it will say something along the lines of 12-01-2008 -

unless they have since changed it again... ford tend to change part numbers or make small modifications, like a wiring harness i just brought lol it had changed part number about 3 times:S.. found out 2 of those were just where they changed the fixings.
 

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QUOTE(RB2004 @ 10 Jan 2010, 06:22 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>its probably listed to 12-01-2008, because that was when the facelift came out.

then when you look under facelift it will say something along the lines of 12-01-2008 -

unless they have since changed it again... ford tend to change part numbers or make small modifications, like a wiring harness i just brought lol it had changed part number about 3 times:S.. found out 2 of those were just where they changed the fixings.
dohh was hoping they would have stuck a pro alloy replica on it
its ok i pick another st up hopefully in 9 days after having a mk7 mountune fiesta for 9 months,previously to that i had an st3 for three years and i remember being one of the lucky one's to have the 11 row intercooler even though i still had the silver lights etc
 

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I have also been trying to find all the changes I know there has been a few.


QUOTE(troy45 @ 9 Jan 2010, 08:27 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Early 07ish they changed the Xenon (and halogen?) lamps from silver reflectors to smoked black effect. Not immediately obvious but noticable once you look closer

So I have a December built 56-reg with the black reflectors that means I have the bigger I/C??
 

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QUOTE(JamieMS @ 10 Jan 2010, 07:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I have also been trying to find all the changes I know there has been a few.

So I have a December built 56-reg with the black reflectors that means I have the bigger I/C??
Yours will have the 11 row intercooler as this came in mid to late 2006 - my car had it and it was a late Aug 06 build.

The changes they do aren't always introduced together -they obviously do for facelifts etc but others are released in dribs and drabs during production
 

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just depends on whats available/to hand... I know alot of components are ordered in on a JIT (Just in time) basis, but they also keep a certain amount available to keep the production line running.. like in the case of wiring looms 2 identical cars but 1 might have a higher spec loom than the other because thats just what was more readily available at the time... also means when they update components initially its pot luck what you get.
 

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QUOTE(RB2004 @ 10 Jan 2010, 09:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>just depends on whats available/to hand... I know alot of components are ordered in on a JIT (Just in time) basis, but they also keep a certain amount available to keep the production line running.. like in the case of wiring looms 2 identical cars but 1 might have a higher spec loom than the other because thats just what was more readily available at the time... also means when they update components initially its pot luck what you get.
That's not the case at all I'm afraid - Ford have a very complex engineering system to manage exactly which parts go on which cars, and a massive logistics organisation to ensure that the right parts are specced through to their suppliers especially where specific parts are sent in by suppliers in exact build order.

If they do run short of certain parts and have an emergency then it takes engineering approval to say that those parts can actually be used on another spec vehicle and then the counts for the affected parts need to be adjusted to offset the loss of a part meant for another vehicle.

When cars are fitted with a higher spec loom than the car actually requires that is because Ford's engineering team have taken the decision to cut down complexity by some commonisation activity and take the hit in the increased cost of the part fitted to the lower spec car.

The logistics department do try to run on a JIT basis and reduce inventory as much as possible but fitting parts willy nilly to diferent spec vehicles plays havoc with this especially if it's done in an uncontrolled manner and nobody knows how many of which bits went on what cars. That's how shortages occur in the first place because more of a certain part is being used than the system is counting.
 
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